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Is scrolling in DeleD tool properties frame bad?

 
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paul_nicholls
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Location: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:41 am    Post subject: Is scrolling in DeleD tool properties frame bad? Reply with quote

Hi all,
I'm looking at adding in 3d perlin noise support for objects like Spheres in DeleD.

This means that when you are creating a sphere (normal, or geosphere), you can choose to add noise to the vertices so they get moved by some pseudo-random amount (using random seed number for repeatability).

This means you can create a round-ish rock, boulder, asteroid, planet, or similar - very handy I think.

When experimenting with adding the new options to the sphere properties frame, I have run out of room, and now a scroll-bar has appeared - see screenshot below.

The left part has the properties frame with no scroll bar.
The right par has the scroll bar after the "Scale vertices using noise" option is selected.



Is this ok, or should I think of something else so no scrolling happens?

I'm not sure how to get around this issue if you have more than x number of options in the property frame...

Ideas, etc. are very welcome Smile

cheers,
Paul
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AWM Mars
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking at the list menu above, that could be arranged like all the other menus and be a grid layout, meaning more space for the box you are using.

I like the prospect of using random seeds for creating models. Deplicting natutre is quite hard, manmade things are much easier.

I'd like to see Displacement mapping with noise generators. Smile
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trucker2000
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't see where the scrollbar is a problem. The primatives section has the same problem. I wouldn't worry about it.
Nice idea tho.
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paul_nicholls
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks guys Smile

BTW, here is a DeleD raytracing of 3 'asteroids' I made using the new sphere noise features (not checked in yet):



It only took me a couple of minutes while I only had to 'tweek' the parameters and created new 'warped' spheres Smile

cheers,
Paul
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paul_nicholls
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

'hands up' who wants me to check this new feature in now Very Happy

cheers,
Paul
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Jeroen
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

*raises hands*

I'd like to play with this next weekend. Very Happy
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AWM Mars
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would a layout like this provide the space needed to accomadate the new functions?
http://www.working.yourinside.com/worlds/ForumPics/MenuOne.gif
Prefabs folders etc can appear in the lower window.
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paul_nicholls
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AWM Mars wrote:
Would a layout like this provide the space needed to accomadate the new functions?
http://www.working.yourinside.com/worlds/ForumPics/MenuOne.gif
Prefabs folders etc can appear in the lower window.


Well, that WOULD give more room...not sure how we could do it though, and it probably doesn't look as 'neat' as the tree view now.

In the meanwhile, I will check in the code so people can play Smile

You can't affect existing sphere primitives with it, only alter the settings prior to doing the usual place sphere and size it.

When the sphere is being sized you can see the warping due to the noise settings.

cheers,
Paul
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chronozphere
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@AWM Mars: All your images don't work (not only in this thread). Do you have server issues?
Edit: It seems fixed now!

@Paul: Great plan to add a noise function. Very Happy

About the scrollbars. I'm allready suffering from that problem because I use a lower DPI. Especially the primitive creation panel looks really small here. I think we need to redesign the Create/Edit panel. I'd say we make one "Create" panel and one "Edit panel". This way, we will also have more room for new tools and new primitive types. Smile

Another remark: You're thinking a bit too specific here. This functionality would be 100x more usefull if it were a separate tool. You could let the user select a set of vertices and give some noise parameters. When the user hit's OK, you could move all selected vertices along their normals, according to the noise function (you have to compute the normals yourself).
This way you could not only make rocks and boulders, but also rough terrain and maybe a water surface with waves. Smile
The most important thing is that users can use your tool when their half way in the modelling process.

I'd encourage you to share your ideas with the community before spending a lot of time to implement them. Feedback could help to refine your plans which saves time in the end.

I'm really looking forward to your added functionality. Very Happy


Last edited by chronozphere on Wed Mar 17, 2010 5:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
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AWM Mars
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronozphere wrote:
@AWM Mars: All your images don't work (not only in this thread). Do you have server issues?

Nope, just checked the server, its fine.
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paul_nicholls
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronozphere wrote:
@AWM Mars: All your images don't work (not only in this thread). Do you have server issues?
Edit: It seems fixed now!

@Paul: Great plan to add a noise function. Very Happy

About the scrollbars. I'm allready suffering from that problem because I use a lower DPI. Especially the primitive creation panel looks really small here. I think we need to redesign the Create/Edit panel. I'd say we make one "Create" panel and one "Edit panel". This way, we will also have more room for new tools and new primitive types. Smile

Another remark: You're thinking a bit too specific here. This functionality would be 100x more usefull if it were a separate tool. You could let the user select a set of vertices and give some noise parameters. When the user hit's OK, you could move all selected vertices along their normals, according to the noise function (you have to compute the normals yourself).
This way you could not only make rocks and boulders, but also rough terrain and maybe a water surface with waves. Smile
The most important thing is that users can use your tool when their half way in the modelling process.

I'd encourage you to share your ideas with the community before spending a lot of time to implement them. Feedback could help to refine your plans which saves time in the end.

I'm really looking forward to your added functionality. Very Happy


Hi chronozphere, thanks for the input Smile

I am planning on doing a separate noise 'warp' tool that can be used on separate objects (grids, spheres, etc) in the same way.

I thought I'd test it on sphere objects first in this way - it was much quicker than adding in a new tool.

I think it is still useful like this though Wink

cheers,
Paul
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chronozphere
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great. Very Happy

Quote:

I think it is still useful like this though Wink


Well, it is but I don't know about having the same functionality available at two places. I'd just put it in one tool.

But this is opensource, so it's up to you. Wink
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paul_nicholls
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronozphere wrote:
Great. Very Happy

Quote:

I think it is still useful like this though Wink


Well, it is but I don't know about having the same functionality available at two places. I'd just put it in one tool.

But this is opensource, so it's up to you. Wink


I think I WILL make it a separate tool only - you are probably right, why duplicate functionality...

Smile

I have now moved the separate tool discussion to this thread:

http://www.delgine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=33994#33994

cheers,
Paul
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AWM Mars
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Either way Paul.. Its going to be a tool people will use Smile
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